Trial Transcripts and Statements for Father Robert Kapoun

Trial Transcripts and Statements for Father Robert Kapoun Trial

These are links to the statements and trial transcripts to the Trial of Father Robert Kapoun. These transcripts show the evil perpetrated upon victims of child rape and how the leaders covered up these crimes and rewarded the pedophile rapist priest and punished the victims.

Deposition of Archbishop John R Roach

http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/784191-deposition-of-archbishop-john-r-roach-july-24-1989.html

HIGHLIGHTS:

Archbishop Roach: “At the same time that he was complaining of back problems… he was also directing a band called the Polka Padres…” pg. 3

Archbishop Roach: “I really wasn’t sure he wanted to be a priest…” pg 4

“[Fr. Srnec] felt that there was something clearly wrong with him…” pg 4

“I would see billboards of the Polka Padre out with his accordion and here’s a guy who wasn’t performing.” pg 5

Archbishop Roach testimony: Difficulty remembering pg 7

“I wanted to know, really, what I could do to be some help to him.”  pg 14

“Was there any question by you about [the victim] and how he was doing…?” pg 14

Archbishop Roach: “Those things certainly I would have tried to do.” pg 17

Jeff Anderson: “You also I think this morning talked about a vault…” pg 17

“He is probably right about Kapoun.”  pg 19

Msgr Stanley J Smec Disposition:

http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/784190-msgr-stanley-j-srnec-deposition-july-7-1989.html

Highlights:

Msgr. Srnec recalls a parishioner alerting him to “impropriety between Father Kapoun” and a boy  pg 5

Father Robert Kapoun Court Documents I

http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/784213-court-documents-1995-96.html

Highlights:

Dale Scheffler initiates lawsuit against Kapoun and archdiocese, Sept. 2, 1994. pg 1

Scheffler complaint, Sept. 2, 1994.  pg 2

Andrew Eisenzimmer signs for summons, Sept. 7, 1994. pg 10

Dale Scheffler’s allegations against the Rev. Kapoun  pg 10

Archbishop John Roach deposition, pp. 68-81, July 24, 1989. pg 68

Judge grants punitive damages claim against Kapoun in 1989 suit, April 20, 1990. pg 89

Judge grants punitive damages claim against Archdiocese of St. Paul and Minneapolis in 1989 suit, April 20, 1990. pg 90

Kapoun 1989 deposition, pp. 105-137 

A jury awards Scheffler $550,000 in damages. pg 140

A jury finds archdiocese liable for $600,000. pg 141

Scheffler awarded reimbursement of legal fees. pg 143

Scheffler awarded reimbursement of legal fees. pg 144

Judge rules for Scheffler and against the archdiocese in the amount of $1.2 million. pg 147

Judge amends case title to identify Dale Scheffler, July 3, 1996.  pg 149

Trial dates. pg 154

Judgment of Aug. 9, 1996 I.  pg 154

Judgment of Aug. 9, 1996 II. pg 155

Court of Appeals ruling, legal fees, Aug. 20, 1997. pg 158

Court of Appeals reverse lower-court ruling – syllabus. pg 161

Court of Appeals reverse lower court decision I, May 20, 1997. pg 167

Court of Appeals reverse lower court decision II, May 20, 1997.  pg 168

Judgment, March 1, 1996. pg 174

Mark Schutz deposition, pp. 228-246 , April 20, 1994. pg 228

Scheffler complaint, pp. 292-299. Sept. 2, 1994 pg 292

Father Robert Kapoun Court Documents II

http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/784217-court-documents-1995-96-ii.html

Highlights:

James Drummond complaint, suit commenced on June 23, 1994; filed Feb. 7, 1995.  pg 2

Kapoun signs receipt for Drummond summons, Aug. 12, 1994. pg 10

Archdiocese signs receipt for Drummond summons, June 27, 1994. pg 12

James Drummond deposition, March 17, 1995, pp. 22-40.  pg 22

Lttr. regarding the Rev. James Porter, Aug. 24, 1967. pg 63

Lttr. regarding the Rev. James Porter, Oct. 9, 1968. pg 64

Lttr. regarding the Rev. James Porter, Aug. 6, 1969. pg 65

Lttr. regarding the Rev. James Porter, Nov. 3, 1970. pg 66

Lttr. regarding the Rev. James Porter, undated.  pg 67

Mark Schutz, jury award, March 25, 1996 pg 69

Kapoun deposition, pp. 97-115, March 7, 1995. pg 97

Victim describes the nature of the abuse pg 121

Victim describes the nature of the abuse (cont.) pg 122

Judgment against Mark Schutz in favor of archdiocese for $3,312.04, Aug. 2, 1996. pg 172

Order amending title of Schutz lawsuit, allowing Schutz to be namd, Aug. 2, 1996. pg 173

Judgment against Schutz due to statute of limitations, March 28, 1996. pg 176

Kapoun responses to interrogatories, Drummond case. pg 177

Kapoun parish-assignment timeline, Dec. 12, 1994. pg 180

Deposition of Curt Raymond, April 14, 1995. pg 370

Judge dismisses Drummond’s case, June 13, 1995. pg 390

Judge in Drummond case uses Mark Schutz case to make decision. pg 392

Drummond case judge rejects argument that sexual abuse perpetrated by a few priests does not require archdiocese to be suspicious of all priests. pg 393

Mark Tuma initiates his lawsuit against Kapoun and the archdiocese, Sept. 15, 1993. pg 395

Archdiocese lawyer, Andrew Eisenzimmer, signs receipt for summons, Sept. 29, 1993. pg 396

Kapoun signs summons receipt, Sept. 23, 1993. pg 398

Mark Tuma deposition, pp. 404-406. pg 404

Mark Tuma complaint, Sept. 15, 1993. pg 406

Deposition of Mark Tuma, pp. 463-471, May 20, 1994.Untitled Note pg 463

Mark Tuma answer to interrogatories, Feb. 1, 1994. pg 472

Deposition of the Rev. Thomas P. Doyle, pp. 509-515, July 1994. pg 509

Deposition of Jane Steinhagen: Kapoun turned religion class to sexual topics, April 30, 1995. pg 521

Steinhagen deposition: Kapoun likened Communion with intercourse with Christ, April 30, 1995. pg 522

Judge dismisses Tuma suit against archdiocese, June 9, 1995 pg 532. 

Judge rules that archdiocese should not have known that Kapoun posed threat to Tuma. pg 534

Judge rules that archdiocese should not have known that Kapoun posed threat to Tuma. pg 536

Father Robert Kapoun Trial Transcripts I

http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/784474-kapoun-trial-transcript-vol-i.html

Highlights:

Jeff Anderson says Kapoun abused several parish children, took them swimming and on overnight trips 

Archdiocese lawyer asks judge to block testimony by other alleged victims of Kapoun 

Archdiocese lawyer: Kapoun was not acting as an employee of the archdiocese when he sexually abused children 

Anderson says Archdiocese knew Kapoun sexually abused a boy in 1973 and did nothing 

Kapoun takes two boys to his cabin, sexually abuses them, attorney says 

Kapoun abuses a sleeping boy at the cabin 

Kapoun’s victim “suffered in secrecy, silence and shame and told no one for years” 

Mother tells a priest in 1973 that Kapoun sexually abused her son 

John Roach, future archbishop, dismisses abuse report in 1973, “Maybe it’s true, maybe it’s not” 

Attorney for victim: The archdiocese swept the allegations under the rug, allowed the abuse to continue. 

Father Robert Kapoun Trial Transcripts II

http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/784217-court-documents-1995-96-ii.html

Highlights:

Archdiocese lawyer: Kapoun wasn’t acting as a priest when he took the boys to the cabin 

Kapoun’s attorney blames the media for putting priests in a “very unenviable position,” says Kapoun “has a black cloud hanging over his head” 

Kapoun’s attorney says there’s no evidence of the abuse, just the testimony of Kapoun and “the accuser” 

“Why Father Kapoun? Father Kapoun is the polka padre.” 

Archbishop Roach says the vicar general “has always played a very rigorous part in the administration of the diocese.” 

Archbishop Roach says he doesn’t remember the report about Kapoun in 1973 

Roach says he knew Kapoun had emotional problems in the 1970s 

Attorney Jeff Anderson asks Archbishop Roach why he suddenly recalls a conversation he previously said he forgot 

Roach says Polka Padre spent most of his time playing the accordion and made excuses for skipping mass 

Another victim testifies that Kapoun manipulated him after his father died 

Victim recalls how Kapoun would try to touch him while swimming in the lake 

Victim tells his mother about Kapoun’s actions 

Victim says he was scared that Kapoun would hurt him again 

Victim says he heard nothing from the archdiocese after he reported sexual abuse 

Priest tells Roach of abuse, says Roach said, of abuse allegations against Kapoun, “Well, maybe he did and maybe he didn’t” 

Priest says he was confident in Roach’s ability to know whether someone was lying about abuse 

Kapoun admits that he was sexually attracted to boys, but says he no longer feels that way 

Kapoun claims he didn’t realize that he was harming the boys  

Kapoun says he took a boy to his family cabin “just to have a good time.” 

Kapoun says he didn’t abuse one boy because he “just didn’t have any curiosity” about him 

Kapoun says he dropped a raw egg down a boy’s pants  

Kapoun says he exercised with a boy in his underwear 

Attorney to Kapoun: “Did you have a sexual interest in this boy?” Kapoun: “Yes, minimum” 

Kapoun offers vague testimony on his sexual interest in boys 

Kapoun explains why he asked a boy to stay overnight, “It was a curiosity of about his genitals.” 

Kapoun claims that a boy touched him in a car, says he didn’t ask the boy to do it 

Kapoun says he brought a boy to his parents’ home and asked him to get into the shower because of his “curiosity” 

Kapoun again claims that a minor touched his genitals without any prompting 

Kapoun admits to touching a boy 

Kapoun of one victim: “I would say he had more interest in me than I did in him.” 

Kapoun admits that he invited a boy to stay with him overnight “probably to see him undressed” 

Kapoun says he didn’t have any sexual interest in Dale Scheffler 

Kapoun says the Archdiocese knew that boys tried to lock him out of their bedrooms 

Another man describes how Kapoun tried to sexually abuse him as a child 

Curt Raymond tells Kevin McDonough about the abuse in 1988 or 1989 

Victim recounts being confused by Kapoun’s abuse. “I was thinking to myself, is this a sacrament?” 

Kapoun victim watches TV report on clergy sex abuse. “It was like somebody hit me with a baseball bat between the eyes.” 

Father Robert Kapoun Trial Transcripts III

http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/784482-kapoun-trial-transcript-vol-3.html

Highlights:

Michael Dearing describes Kapoun taking him to the Cold Spring cabin 

Plaintiff expert says victim Dale Scheffler has a “classic and severe learning disability” 

Plaintiff expert says trauma can make a learning disability more severe 

Therapist says Dale Scheffler “was afraid that the abuse was continuing and feared for the kids” 

Dale Scheffler’s therapist describes how the abuse led to other problems in Scheffler’s life 

Therapist describes Scheffler’s fear that the church will retaliate against his family; describes how Scheffler saw Kapoun by chance on the freeway 

Therapist says Scheffler used alcohol and drugs to push away memories of the abuse 

Therapist says Scheffler will likely need at least 150 hours of therapy over five years 

Archdiocese attorney questions victim’s commitment to therapy 

Archdiocese attorney suggests the lawsuit, not the abuse, was the source of Scheffler’s stress 

Archdiocese lawyer grills therapist on the reasons why Scheffler started drinking and using drugs 

Archdiocese lawyer claims that the victim’s father was an alcoholic 

Attorney asks why a boy’s parents allowed him to stay with Kapoun at the cabin. “Because he was our priest and supposedly it’s supposed to be safe.” 

Archdiocese attorney picks apart details about the overnight trip to the cabin, focuses on whether Kapoun’s mother was there and whether one of the boys slept in a sleeping bag 

Archdiocese attorneys asks a man to describe the cabin he visited when he was 11 years old 

Kapoun’s attorney grills a witness about the details of the overnight trip to the cabin 

Kapoun’s attorney asks a witness to recall a visit to Kapoun’s cabin when he was 11 years old. Asks what the boys ate, and whether the food was cooked or cold 

Father Robert Kapoun Trial Transcripts IV

http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/800661-transcript-vol-4-from-anderson.html

Highlights:

Next Dale Scheffler describes how his family trusted Kapoun and allowed the priest to take him on an overnight trip when he was about 13 years old 

Previous Next Scheffler describes how Kapoun abused him while swimming in the lake  

Previous Next Scheffler, recounting abuse, “I felt nothing. I don’t know what to feel.” 

Previous Next Archdiocese attorney questions Scheffler about his dating history 

Previous Next Archdiocese attorney questions Scheffler about whether his father is an alcoholic 

Previous Next Archdiocese attorney grills Scheffler on whether the other boy at the cabin slept in a sleeping bag 

Previous Next Archdiocese attorney asks Scheffler if he told his mother specifically that “Father Kapoun had touched you with his penis and had tried to put it in your butt?” Scheffler says, “I don’t know … I was a little kid.” 

Previous Archdiocese attorney suggests Scheffler may have been traumatized by his father’s struggles with arthritis 

Father Robert Kapoun Trial Transcripts V

http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/784486-kapoun-trial-transcript-vol-5.html

Highlights:

Kapoun explains how he got the nickname “Polka Padre” 

Kapoun says his behavior with Michael Dearing was “very very wrong” 

Kapoun claims he slept in between two boys because he “didn’t want any horseplay between the two individuals” 

Kapoun: “I never abused Dale Scheffler.” 

Anderson asks a doctor to compare the stress of the lawsuit to the stress of knowing that Kapoun remained a pastor; Archdiocese attorney objects 

Archdiocese attorney says the lawsuit may have caused Scheffler’s stress 

Expert witness for the archdiocese says Scheffler was not severely mentally ill 

Expert witness for the archdiocese lists Scheffler’s stressors; he includes “litigation over alleged abuse by priest,” does not include the abuse itself 

Expert witness for the archdiocese says Scheffler blamed others for his problem “and until he starts taking some responsibility for making changes in his life, I was not optimistic that he would respond to treatment” 

Expert witness for the archdiocese says Scheffler’s progress in therapy should be closely tracked because “there is always the danger of someone who has a problem with depression and who is being very blaming and having a lot of old baggage … [will] continue to dwell on that …” 

Jeff Anderson fires back at archdiocese expert about whether Scheffler has taken responsibility for making changes in his life 

Expert witness for archdiocese says, “There are some people who don’t really want to be happy.” 

Father Robert Kapoun Trial Transcripts VI

http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/800662-transcript-vol-6-from-anderson.html

Highlights:

Archdiocese’s attorney: “If he was abused, we are not saying he wasn’t harmed by that to some extent.” 

Archdiocese attorney: Victim knew right away that he had been sexually abused 

Archdiocese attorney says a reasonable person in the victim’s situation would’ve realized that being sexually abused led to shame, guilt and personal problems.. 

Archdiocese attorney: If Kapoun sexually abused Scheffler, he wasn’t acting as a priest when he did it. 

Archdiocese attorney expands on argument that Kapoun wasn’t acting as a priest when he abused children. 

Archdiocese attorney: Any abuse by Kapoun took place during Kapoun’s time off. 

Archdiocese attorney tries to cast doubt on testimony about the church’s knowledge of the abuse in the 1970s. 

Archdiocese attorney says someone has to be mistaken about the overnight trip with Kapoun and two boys because witnesses have different recollections of whether they took a shower or slept in a sleeping bag. 

Instructions to the jury: “What sum of money will fairly compensate dale Scheffler for his damages up to the date of trial?” 

Archdiocese lawyer tells the jury that Scheffler should receive no more than $2,548 for past medical, therapy and counseling expenses. 

Archdiocese attorney says jurors have no proof that Scheffler lost earnings because of the abuse. 

Archdiocese attorney advises jury to award no more than $80,000 for compensatory damages. 

Archdiocese attorney: Scheffler does not appear to be suffering financially because he took a vacation to the Black Hills. 

Archdiocese attorney tells jury that they should award no more than $40,000 for future damages. 

Kapoun’s attorney: Abuse allegations are “15 years stale” 

Kapoun’s attorney cites conflicting testimony on whether the boys had sleeping bags 

Previous Next Kapoun’s attorney says alleged victim was looking for someone to blame for his personal problems 

Previous Next Kapoun’s attorney suggests the alleged victim could be making false accusations to get money 

Previous Next Kapoun’s attorney says Scheffler and his mother should’ve known it was abuse right away if the story was true 

Previous Next Jeff Anderson to jury: “I will not be eloquent but I will be honest.” 

Previous Next Jeff Anderson: “Bringing this case … has been and is one of the gravest responsibilities I have ever taken or undertaken as a person and as a lawyer” 

Previous Next Jeff Anderson says pedophiles like Kapoun need to be punished and removed from ministry 

Previous Next Jeff Anderson: “Dale after the abuse began a descent into hell and there is no question about that.” 

Previous Next Jeff Anderson, of Scheffler after the abuse, “He began these processes of burying and copying and without a clue why his life was so messed up. He isolated, he changed his friends, he began to use drugs and alcohol. All the while thinking there is something wrong with him and not knowing or having a way to know why this is.” 

Previous Next Jeff Anderson calls the suggestion that Scheffler should’ve immediately known it was sexual abuse “offensive” 

Previous Next Jeff Anderson says mother allowed her child to spend time with Kapoun because he was a priest, “the man they were taught to worship God through.” 

Previous Next Jeff Anderson casts doubt on Archbishop Roach’s testimony 

Previous Next Jeff Anderson suggests that jurors award Scheffler $134,000 for future loss of earnings 

Previous Jeff Anderson asks jurors to decide in favor of his client “to share in the rage and to be a part of his recovery and how he walks that road ahead” 

Father Robert Kapoun Trial Transcripts VII

http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/784496-kapoun-trial-transcript-vol-7.html

Highlights:

Attorneys discuss how Kapoun had previously admitted sexually abusing another boy in 1969 

Archdiocese attorney says “there was no proof” that Kapoun was “acting in the scope of employment” when he took the boys to the cabin 

Archdiocese attorney claims that punishing the church would violate the U.S. Constitution 

Jury awards victim $277,742 for damages that occurred prior to trial 

Jury awards victim $272,258 for future expenses, lost earnings, disability, emotional distress and embarassment 

Judge Gary Larson threatens to sanction Archdiocese lawyer $1,000 a day until Archbishop Roach returns from Florida to testify 

Judge Gary Larson shows frustration, suggests he wouldn’t be surprised if Archbishop Roach had left the country 

Archdiocese lawyer: Archbishop Roach is actually leaving the country 

Attorney Jeff Anderson offers to charter a plane to fly Archbishop Roach to Minnesota to testify 

Judge Gary Larson explains that jurors need to determine whether it’s likely the archdiocese “acted with willful indifference to the rights or safety of others.” 

Judge Gary Larson explains how the jury should decide the amount of punitive damages 

Kapoun meets with top church leaders in 1984 and admits to touching a boy; Church leaders ask Kapoun to resign from his parishes 

Kapoun resigns as pastor to prevent a victim’s family from calling police 

Kapoun says he talked with Bishop Carlson in 1987 about his sexual abuse of boys, Carlson asks Kapoun to seek a psychological evaluation 

Kapoun tells his parishioners he’s going on a vacation, spends that time receiving a psychological evaluation for child sexual abuse 

Top church deputy Kevin McDonough asks Kapoun in 1989 if he sexually abused one boy, Kapoun admits it 

Kapoun says Bishop Carlson told him in 1987 that the statute of limitation had expired on some of his unreported crimes 

Kapoun says church officials told him in the late 1980s not to spend time with boys but did not restrict him in any other way 

Kapoun says vicar general Kevin McDonough required him to attend therapy and confess his sins once a month 

Kapoun says he realized in therapy that he had a compulsive sexual interest in boys 

Archdiocese attorney asks Kapoun to assure jurors that his conduct at a parish since 1984 “has been above reproach” 

Archdiocese attorney asks Kapoun for his opinion on whether the church has put enough restrictions on him to protect children; Kapoun says restrications were “absolutely sufficient” 

Anderson asks Kapoun if he’s considered the impact of denying that he abused young men who are coming forward about abuse as children; Archdiocese lawyer objects 

Father Robert Kapoun Trial Transcripts VIII

http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/800665-transcript-vol-8.html

Highlights: None

Father Robert Kapoun Trial Transcripts IX

http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/784498-kapoun-trial-transcript-9.html

Highlights:

Jeff Anderson cross examines Archbishop John Roach 

Archbishop John Roach: “Would it help you if I would tell you a little bit about my style of administration?” Jeff Anderson: “No, it would help me if you would answer the question.” 

Jeff Anderson to Archbishop Roach: “You were gambling not with money but with children’s lives, weren’t you?” Roach: “Not intentionally.” 

Archbishop Roach says he transferred Kapoun out of St. Patrick’s Church because the victim’s parents were threatening to call police 

Archbishop Roach admits that “it was certainly a gamble” to reassign Kapoun knowing that he had sexually abused children in the past 

Archbishop Roach says he never met with anyone abused by Kapoun 

Archbishop Roach: “I made a judgment that there had been a dramatic change in Father Kapoun’s life and in his pattern and that he was safe in dealing with other people as proved to be true.” 

Anderson asks Archbishop Roach what he did to help the victims of Kapoun; Roach says, “I am sure we were concerned about them and I can’t tell you, Mr. Anderson, what we did about them.” 

Archbishop John Roach claims God intervened and changed Kapoun’s heart and soul 

Archbishop Roach says Kapoun was a “dramatically changed person” who was believable, holy and honest about his past actions 

Archbishop Roach says he hasn’t met with any of Kapoun’s victims and doesn’t know whether anyone on his staff has done so, either 

Vicar General Kevin McDonough: “Mr. Anderson has taught us a lot of things, and the victims he has represented have taught us a lot of things.” 

Vicar General Kevin McDonough describes restrictions placed on Kapoun 

Vicar General Kevin McDonough says parishioners weren’t told anything about Kapoun’s past until a victim sued 

Vicar General Kevin McDonough says Kapoun has already been “punished by public disclosure of his offenses … limitation on his ministry … mandated assessment and mandated treatment.” 

Jeff Anderson asks McDonough: “When you continued (Kapoun) in the parish, you in effect allowed him to continue to deny the abuse of all of those boys publicly?” McDonough: “That’s correct.” 

Father Robert Kapoun Trial Transcripts X

http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/784500-kapoun-trial-transcript-10.html

Highlights:

Archdiocese “avoided scandal” by keeping abusive priests in ministry 

Archdiocese attorney says, “Certainly the attitude and the conduct of the Archdiocese at times has been inappropriate and lacking in the type of response we would all today expect from the Archdiocese.” 

Church lawyer says, “Certainly the Archdiocese has been punished over and over for these mistakes of the past.” 

Church lawyer says the archdiocese “has been punished severely” by clergy abuse lawsuits 

Church lawyer says the archdiocese has “clearly learned from these mistakes of the past” and should be encouraged, not punished 

Church lawyer says “hope has emerged … that the church has seen the path that leads in the direction of prevention of future harm” 

Jeff Anderson says the church profitted by keeping clergy sex abuse secret 

Jeff Anderson says the archdiocese “create a danger and a menance, and it has been there for every day since.” 

Jeff Anderson says his earlier lawsuits “have had no affect on the way they are doing business … the way they are gambling with the lives of these kids every time they put a predatory priest in a parish.” 

Jeff Anderson asks jurors, “Did you hear Father McDonough say shockingly that when these come forward now we report them to the police if they are recent but not if they are older. What is going on here?” 

Jeff Anderson tells jurors they have a “solemn obligation to … serve as an example and to return a verdict that strikes the bell and delivers a blow, and that is no less than ten million dollars.” 

Jury finds that the archdiocese should pay $600,000 in punitive damages